New TWA Flight 800 film coming out

[mrbusdriver]

...like Godzilla vs Bambi...

but, wait...AL may have something here....has he finally found some actual "findings"??!! I get the impression he never read the actual accident report...

 

[JayUtah]

On the contrary. It supports the deliberate detonation.

Nonsense. You're simply quoting the established chain of events and declaring in non sequitur fashion that it is evidence of malfeasance. 100 percent wishful thinking.

Brushing it off as coincidences is an insufficient excuse.

You're not qualified or competent to make that determination.

 

[Anders Lindman]

Nonsense. You're simply quoting the established chain of events and declaring in non sequitur fashion that it is evidence of malfeasance. 100 percent wishful thinking.



You're not qualified or competent to make that determination.

A chain of events consistent with the deliberate detonation scenario, which stands on its own without me having to prove I'm an expert.

 

[JayUtah]

A chain of events consistent with the deliberate detonation scenario...

No, it's consistent with several scenarios, including the prevailing findings.

...which stands on its own...

No, it's one of several possible explanations for the temperature of the fuel. That you arbitrarily prefer one of these is not proof that it's the one that must have occurred.

...without me having to prove I'm an expert.

The opinion that it was "brushed off as a coincidence" and that such an explanation is an "insufficient excuse" is probative only when so judged by a competent expert. You are simply trying to browbeat people into agreeing with your uninformed denial of the experts' findings.

 

[Anders Lindman]

"Another potential ignition source that investigators considered was the detonation of a small explosive charge585 that had been placed on the CWT that could have breached the fuel tank and ignited the flammable fuel/air vapor. However, testing by the Safety Board and the British Defense Evaluation and Research Agency in August 1997 at Bruntingthorpe Airfield, Leicestershire England, demonstrated that when metal of the same type and thickness as the CWT walls was penetrated by a small charge, there was petalling of the surface on which the charge was placed, pitting on the adjacent surfaces, and visible hot gas washing damage in the surrounding area. As discussed in section 2.2.1.2, none of these damage characteristics were found on the recovered CWT wreckage, and none of the areas of missing skin were large enough to represent the damage that would have been caused by the detonation of a small explosive charge. Therefore, it is very unlikely that a small explosive charge detonated on the CWT, breached the fuel tank, and ignited the fuel/air vapor." -- 2.3.1.4 Small Explosive Charge -- http://www.ntsb.gov/doclib/reports/2000/AAR0003.pdf

The official report says it's very unlikely that a small explosive charge caused the TWA 800 fuel tank explosion because of petalling of the surface. Wait a minute, what petalling?

Shaped charge -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdrmCYBPP2g

 

[JayUtah]

Wait a minute...

No, Lindman. Not all "petalling" is automatically interchangeable. Again, here you go attempting to play expert while not having the requisite expertise.

 

[fess]

Whoa. I found interesting information. Not any direct proof but anyway. The jet fuel vapor had to be warm enough to be flammable. And since the explosion happened only 12 minutes after takeoff, the center wing fuel tank had to be "cooked" before takeoff. And that's what happened. The tank was exposed to heat from air condition units for nearly 3 hours just before the plane took off.

Nearly 18 years after the fact, and you found out something that was known the following day after the crash? You are really good at research…. not.
You do know it is common practice to run the air conditioning equipment while the aircraft is sitting on the ramp right?

 

[fess]

Both the first source and the second source support the idea of a shaped charge as being the cause of the explosion, since the reasons for ruling it out are weak and vague. Ask an expert if you don't believe me.

Who is the “they” you keep mentioning?

How did we go from a remote controlled B-747 taking off complete with false voice communications to an aircraft brought down by a shaped charge? If a shaped charge had been used, it would have deformed the outer skin of the aircraft. There was no mention of this in any of the reports.

 

[Anders Lindman]

You do know it is common practice to run the air conditioning equipment while the aircraft is sitting on the ramp right?

Yes, I think it was staged so that the plane could sit and cook the fuel tank for a long time. For example some missing/misplaced luggage took a long time to sort out. Nothing unusual yet a necessary part for making the fuel tank explode.

 

[Anders Lindman]

"Chemical analyses by the laboratories were consistent and showed that the dark brown splatter material was consistent with a polyurethane elastomer." -- 16.4.6 Examination of Brown Splatter Material -- http://www.ntsb.gov/doclib/reports/2000/AAR0003.pdf

"A shaped charge casing 1 designed to be nested to reduce overall volume, which benefits storage or carriage. ... The lid and body portions may be formed of polymeric material. Preferably the lid and body of the shaped charge will be comprised of structural polyurethane foam. This is a lightweight material that is easy to manufacture at low cost. This material is considered non-fragmenting which allows a very low weapon danger area when compared with other commonly used shaped charge casing materials." -- http://www.google.com/patents/US20140060369

 

[Anders Lindman]

"The group explored possible airplane sources of higher than normal heat incoming to the area of the splatter. The only airplane source identified by the group was possible overheated trim air entering the duct between stringers 21-22. Splatter on the top of the WCS appeared to extend to the *‘Y” inlet area for the trim air. The insulated metal trim air pipe attaches to the conditioned air duct inlet via an elastomeric sleeve/jubilee clip connector. This trim air pipe was located within the recovered wreckage and examined. As recovered it contained a separated portion of the elastomeric sleeve still connected to the end that attaches to the **Y” inlet. Examination of the sleeve piece disclosed no evidence of an overheated condition." -- Factual Report on Splatter Deposits, pp. 10: http://twa800.sites.usa.gov/files/twa800/DCA96MA070/255738.pdf

From the same report, pp. 9:

"Had been at a temperature in excess of 493" F (256" C), as determined by the softening temperature and may have been at higher temperatures resulting in a scorched appearance and/or hardening (a portion of deposit 1 around SWB3)."

 

[Anders Lindman]

Who is the “they” you keep mentioning?

How did we go from a remote controlled B-747 taking off complete with false voice communications to an aircraft brought down by a shaped charge? If a shaped charge had been used, it would have deformed the outer skin of the aircraft. There was no mention of this in any of the reports.

The remote control / autopilot would still have been needed. The fuel tank was detonated without any people on board.

The official report describes lack of evidence of small explosive charge and says that none of the missing pieces were large enough to cover the damage from such explosion.

As I indicated in an earlier post, the damage from a shaped charge would have been a tiny hole, not a big area as the report describes. And at most splatter material ejected in the direction of the charge. The report seems to be describing an ordinary small explosive charge, not a shaped charge which conveniently has been omitted in the report.

 

[Anders Lindman]

Who is the “they” you keep mentioning?

A secret cabal. The U.S. government was taken by surprise, first via a large number of false witnesses who claimed they saw a streak of light moving towards TWA 800. This was to make the FBI involved early on in the investigation, because when no bodies were found of victims, the entire U.S. government apparatus needed to start doing a massive coverup.

So the U.S. government was forced/tricked into doing a coverup, as a preparation for the 9/11 attacks a few years later where the U.S. government again was taken by surprise.

 

[abaddon]

"Chemical analyses by the laboratories were consistent and showed that the dark brown splatter material was consistent with a polyurethane elastomer." -- 16.4.6 Examination of Brown Splatter Material -- http://www.ntsb.gov/doclib/reports/2000/AAR0003.pdf

"A shaped charge casing 1 designed to be nested to reduce overall volume, which benefits storage or carriage. ... The lid and body portions may be formed of polymeric material. Preferably the lid and body of the shaped charge will be comprised of structural polyurethane foam. This is a lightweight material that is easy to manufacture at low cost. This material is considered non-fragmenting which allows a very low weapon danger area when compared with other commonly used shaped charge casing materials." -- http://www.google.com/patents/US20140060369

Watch out Anders, your keyboard is a shaped charge, since it is full of polyurethane.

 

[SUSpilot]

I haven't participated here in a long time, Anders, but I recall mentioning to you that I knew the flight engineer's brother. How does that square with "no people on board"?

 

[abaddon]

I haven't participated here in a long time, Anders, but I recall mentioning to you that I knew the flight engineer's brother. How does that square with "no people on board"?

Simple. In Anders World^TM you are an ebil gubbmint shill and disinfo agent. You are paid to pretend. That's what he believes, or at least pretends to believe.

 

[Anders Lindman]

I haven't participated here in a long time, Anders, but I recall mentioning to you that I knew the flight engineer's brother. How does that square with "no people on board"?

If my conspiracy theory is correct, and if you are correct, then the flight engineer could still be alive today!

 

[tsig]

Impossible because the government wouldn't lie to you? Not even in the name of national security?

My government would never lie to me, why right now I have a chicken in every pot* their agent is coming here to help and they have the check in the mail.

*do you have a good solution for cleaning chicken poop from pots?

 

[tsig]

The crew and the passengers never entered the plane. And then the plane took off with some kind of remote control perhaps. Radio communication was done from another location nearby, with the real crew pretending to be inside the plane.

Remote control was done by telekinesis.

 

[tsig]

More believable than an electric spark and victims' bodies having the same DNA because their flesh had been fused because the explosion was so strong, as one of the experts claimed.

The bodies had the same DNA because they were vat grown clones.