Seven dead in drive by California shootings

[Travis]

Apparently this is Obama's fault for making everyone think they deserve things. http://www.theblaze.com/stories/201...e-the-manifesto-of-santa-barbara-mass-slayer/

Check the comments for extra crazy.

 

[quadraginta]

And what mental illness might that be?

(Hint: "spree-killer" is not an actual mental illness)

Hint: "Spree killing" can certainly be evidence of one.

 

[quadraginta]

Do you believe that all premeditated murders involve mental illness?

Do you believe that no premeditated murders involve mental illness?

 

[TubbaBlubba]

I became known as the “weird kid” at Pinecrest, and people started to make fun of me, but I didn’t
care. I had my online games to distract me from the harsh realities of life that I was too scared to face. The only time I did care was when a group of popular Seventh Grade girls started teasing me, which hurt a lot. One of these girls was Monette Moio,
a pretty blonde girl who was Ashton’s younger sister
. She must have thought I was an ultimate loser. I hated her so much, and I will never forget her. I started to hate all girls because of this. I saw them as mean, cruel, and heartless creatures that took pleasure from my suffering.

This sounds pretty unlikely; I call unreliable narrator. A pretty girl teased me once, then I started hating all women! Yeah...

 

[The Mutha]

MRM = Men's Rights Movement. They believe women are trying to relegate or have succeeded in relegating men to a second-class status using cultural, legal, and political institutions to destroy or marginalize their masculinity and rights as men.

MRA = An advocate of this movement.

PUA = Pick-up artist. They view women as objects existing solely to have sex with men. They express this philosophy by trying to pick up women for sex, sharing "techniques" with each other, and complaining about women that the techniques don't work on.

TRP = No idea.

On Reddit - The Red Pill: Discussion of sexual strategy in a culture increasingly lacking a positive identity for men.

 

[applecorped]

No, and don't bother trying to derail this thread with nonsense, thanks.

Asking you to clarify your statements is derailing and nonsense?

 

[applecorped]

Do you believe that no premeditated murders involve mental illness?

I'm sure some do.

 

[Dissolution]

Having read through his whole autobiography and contrary to what I initially thought from a quick browse of the "highlights", he was definitely mentally ill and pretty divorced from reality.
He seems to have provided a ton of evidence of this to all around him, but only received minimal help for his problems, but plenty of money instead.

He almost certainly had Narcissistic Personality Disorder and probably one or two other things, too.
He seemed to totally lose touch with reality for a number of years.

 

[SezMe]

He was also a WOW addict.

Relevance?

 

[Dissolution]

Relevance?

Endless hours spent in an anti-social activity during his formative years, which both isolated him from any contact with other people and lead to some extremely negative feelings towards the one person who actually tried to help him, his step-mother.

 

[Arcade22]

I'm not sure that there was anything clinically wrong with him, going by his own writing.
He just seems to have been massively overindulged by one parent and virtually ignored by the other.
He might have had some sort of personality disorder which may have been exaggerated by his anti-social interests and the misogynistic nature of the PUA stuff that he got into, but it's hard to tell from one fairly short source.

He was just a really narcissistic aspie with a spoiled brat life. His parents constantly did what he wanted and he got is way always. They even bought him a new laptop when the one he was using got a virus!

However when it came to other people, or more exactly women, he didn't get what he wanted and he didn't really understand why due to being so pathetically socially incompetent. Naturally, since it couldn't be his own pathetic mindset and logic that was the problem, it was only a matter of time before he lashed out at other people because of his jealousy.

Just read how full of himself he is:

I laugh at those two losers in this thread who called me "an average looking manlet". It's so ridiculous that I'm laughing instead of getting angry.
I am a drop-dead gorgeous, fabulous, stylish, exotic gem among thousands of rocks. I'm one of a kind, completely opposite of average.
You're just jealous because I'm better looking that you, and you know it.

 

[TubbaBlubba]

I con
tinued searching for a job, but I still wasn’t able to find one. I refused all of the jobs that Tony
suggested to me. The problem was that most of the jobs that were available to me at the time were jobs I considered to be beneath me. My mother wanted me to get a simple retail job, and the thought of myself doing that was mortifying. It would be completely against my character. I am an intellectual who is destined for greatness. I would never perform a low-class service job.

Halfway through, I think that a lot of the manifesto is drenched in hindsight, rationalizations and bias. He seems to ascribe a lot of elaborate motivations, make tenuous connections and wonky reasons for why he is the way he is ("I was so bored I had to be weird" is a classic). I have trouble taking much of what he writes about his teens, at least, without a big pinch of salt. Stripping away the melodrama and presumed exaggerations, it sounds like he had a pretty ordinary, if somewhat troubled and frustrated, lonely teen life. His supposed radicalizations later aren't that unusual either.

Narcissistic tendencies seem pretty obviously present, although I'm not really seeing him being divorced from reality yet. Having delusions of grandeur and being self-obsessed, though? Yes.

 

[One Tenth]

If it's true that the traditional gender roles that MRA's are opposed to are those you mention - merely the male actor/female subject generalization - then their opposition to feminism becomes complicated, because feminists tend not only to oppose that same generalization, but most of the anecdotes they give in which they complain about the behavior of men, are cases in which they feel men were acting or attempting to act upon a woman or women, in an illustration of those very roles.

Sorry for the delay in replying, was a bit busy. MRA opposition to feminism is indeed complicated (and in other places, frustratingly simplified). Feminism is such a big tent that it's really difficult to attribute any one belief to it. MRAs similarly have a spread of beliefs, but not anywhere near as large or developed.

Some MRAs blindly oppose all feminism, whether due to not understanding it, misogyny, being hurt by it, who knows why. Many have valid criticisms of feminism, but generally don't bother differentiating between the various branches, with the justification that others support feminism as a whole. Heck, there are many MRAs that consider themselves feminists (I'd probably call myself both, depending on which definitions you use).


I personally don't find feminism to be consistently against the gender role of men being actors, women being acted upon. One of the more concrete examples of this would be the narratives used for domestic violence. In a more abstract sense, putting the shaping of culture mostly/entirely to the agency of men seems fairly common as well.

 

[Autolite]

I will be sad if the discussion about this incident decides to focus on the fact that he used a gun, rather than the far more contributory toxic ideology of this man.

"A U.S. man who posted a YouTube video calmly describing how he planned to gun down young women went on a rampage shortly afterward, stabbing three people to death in his apartment before fatally shooting three others elsewhere"

"The family is "staunchly against guns" and supports gun-control laws, Shifman added."

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/7-dead-7-injured-drive-shooting-student-enclave-111723538.html

No worries there Checkmite. The fact that he murdered three people by stabbing them to death seems to have dampened a bit the 'gun' issue.

I am a little curious about the family's anti-gun attitude though. Does this mean that they're okay with those other three folks who were stabbed to death? It seems to me that an anti-knife/knife control stance would be equally justifiable.

Unless of course he stabbed those victims with a gun...

 

[quadraginta]

I'm sure some do.

Can't figure out if that is a 'yes' or a 'no'.

I wasn't asking "some". I was asking you.

 

[marplots]

Halfway through, I think that a lot of the manifesto is drenched in hindsight, rationalizations and bias. He seems to ascribe a lot of elaborate motivations, make tenuous connections and wonky reasons for why he is the way he is ("I was so bored I had to be weird" is a classic). I have trouble taking much of what he writes about his teens, at least, without a big pinch of salt. Stripping away the melodrama and presumed exaggerations, it sounds like he had a pretty ordinary, if somewhat troubled and frustrated, lonely teen life. His supposed radicalizations later aren't that unusual either.

Narcissistic tendencies seem pretty obviously present, although I'm not really seeing him being divorced from reality yet. Having delusions of grandeur and being self-obsessed, though? Yes.

Your whole post sounds right to me. And if the highlighted portion is correct, was he one of an endless supply of such shooters? Is there a distribution and he just happened to be in the tail?

I really don't think we can distinguish between "borderline" and "will kill."

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

He was also a WOW addict.

So were Mila Kunis and Felicia Day. I'm not sure I see the relevance.

 

[TubbaBlubba]

So were Mila Kunis and Felicia Day. I'm not sure I see the relevance.

I'm sure it played a part, but as a double edged sword. On the one hand, it probably allowed him some relief and some feelings of having friends; on the other, it made him more isolated and withdrawn from the world, and created tension with his family.

 

[Checkmite]

Are you implying that Jezebel is an objective, unbiased source?

No; but it is a source, and its impression is consistent with my own impression of the content of these sorts of sites - that they obsess over getting sex, rage about "ugly sluts" and "shallow (expletives)" that don't express sexual interest in them, and - as mentioned before - that those who dislike PUAs dislike them not for their callous objectification of women or their philosophy that females essentially exist to be harvested for sex, but rather that the PUAs' advice is ineffective for the purposes of said harvesting. This is so vastly at odds with Doghouse Reilly's characterization of them as respectable guys who would just really like to settle down with a girl someday and are accepting and understanding of women who don't presently find them attractive, that it's difficult to believe the two are talking about the same website. It's important to note that the Jezebel piece not only included quotes from the forum, but also included links to those posts so that a reader could visit the site directly and see whether it was a matter of cherry-picking or quoting out-of-context. Of course, the links don't work now because the site is offline, and unfortunately this also prevents Doghouse Reilly from being able to post links supporting his interpretation as well. I suppose the matter can't be settled until the site comes back online, if it ever does.

 

[Checkmite]

This sounds pretty unlikely; I call unreliable narrator. A pretty girl teased me once, then I started hating all women! Yeah...

I think that when people adopt a worldview at some point in their life, it's common (and natural) for them to mentally "edit" their personal history in order to make it conform more closely to the narrative their new worldview suggests. A born-again Christian might insist he never had a moment of happiness until the day he "truly found Jesus"; a particularly anti-Christian atheist might recall being more afraid of Hell and the devil as a child than he really was. People who go through messy divorces will often refuse to recall any memories of love or happy times with their ex-spouse. Even outside of that, it's pretty common for adults to attach complicated chains of adult logic to decisions and actions they made as young children. I think I agree with you, it's quite unlikely this one girl teasing him held any special significance at the time, only that which he later attached as an adult looking back.